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b-greek-digest V1 #866
b-greek-digest Wednesday, 20 September 1995 Volume 01 : Number 866
In this issue:
Re: Re- Teaching accents
Re: Re- Teaching accents
Re: Ghost Riters in Disguise?
RE- Accents
SYNOPTIC PROBLEM EXEGESIS RE
Re: Re- Teaching accents
Re: RE- Accents
Spelling Anti-Flame [was: Accents]
Trinity and Deity
Re: Re- Teaching accents
unsubscribe
Re: Ghost Riters in Disguise?
Calling Jesus "God" in the NT
Re: Re- Teaching accents
Q: Pronunciation
Re: Trinity and Deity
Re: Re- Teaching accents
Re: RE- Accents
Re: Re- Teaching accents
unsubscribe
unsubscribe
unsubscribe
Re: Q: Pronunciation
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 06:30:22 -0500
Subject: Re: Re- Teaching accents
At 5:26 PM 9/19/95, Karen Pitts wrote:
>On Tue, 19 Sep 1995, DR. KEN PULLIAM wrote:
>
>> I have a question for those who teach Koine Greek. How valuable
>> is it for the first year student to be taught the rules for
>> accenting?
>
>I've shephered two classes of adults through Koine Greek through our church
>where what the seminary covers in a semester takes us 2 to 3 years. Believe
>me, I try to keep it as simple as possible. I think accents are essential.
>There are several words that differ only in accent. EI (if) without an
>accent, and EI (you are) with a circumflex are examples of early vocab which
>require knowing the accents. I don't think the accents are any more confusing
>than conjugation for native English speakers, the concepts of tenses that
>convey type of action rather than time, or the middle voice. At least accents
>have fairly straightforward rules.
I teach classical Attic mostly, but I am currently teaching Homeric in one
class and Koine in tutorial. I always go through the accents carefully,
tell students that they should learn the rules for accentuation of verbs
and enclitics, and tell them that they OUGHT to memorize the place of
accents on adjectives and nouns. I do think that it's important to get the
accents right on the 3+ different senses of "H", two senses of "ARA", etc.
On the other hand, I've never taken grades off for a missed accent on a
paper. And the reason is a confession that I make to my classes but haven't
really publicized: Some forty years ago in Munich I turned in a seminar
paper on Aristophanes to Rudolf Pfeiffer and got back on it only one
comment, "which, being interpreted, is": 'It's evident that you never
really learned the accents on Greek; I suggest that you either get them
right or omit them altogether!'
While it is certainly true that the accents help to distinguish words that
are spelled the same way, can anyone demonstrate any other value to
teaching them or writing them? And perhaps more significantly, does anyone
who teaches them also endeavor to teach a pronunciation in terms of a pitch
accent, which is what the accents were really meant to illustrate? I
imagine that most people teach students to use a stress accent on the
syllable accented in the Greek word. I make one single effort to show
students what the pitch accent MAY have sounded like (I don't really think
we have anything but a theoretical conception of this, although I am aware
that some scholars have prepared tapes of the PROPER pronunciation of the
accents). In fact, I rather suspect that those of us who teach Greek and
participate in this List use five or six different standards of
pronunciation!
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University
One Brookings Drive, St. Louis, MO, USA 63130
(314) 935-4018
cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu OR cwc@oui.com
WWW: http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~cwconrad/
------------------------------
From: "James D. Ernest" <ernest@mv.mv.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 10:34:18 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Re- Teaching accents
On Wed, 20 Sep 1995, Carl W. Conrad wrote:
> While it is certainly true that the accents help to distinguish words that
> are spelled the same way, can anyone demonstrate any other value to
> teaching them or writing them?
Ritual/religious value. If Greek students aren't circumflexed
by the 8th session, do they really have any share in the
DIAQHKH? The pain may be acute, but skipping it is a grave
error.
But on CWC's other point: I can't imagine teaching pitch values
to students (or, let's be honest, bothering to learn them).
- -----------------------------------------------------------------
James D. Ernest Joint Doctoral Program
Manchester, New Hampshire, USA Andover-Newton/Boston College
Internet: ernest@mv.mv.com Chestnut Hill, Massachusetts
------------------------------
From: Bruce Terry <terry@bible.acu.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 09:40:53 CST
Subject: Re: Ghost Riters in Disguise?
On Tue, 19 Sep 1995, Ellen Adams wrote:
>Subject: Ghost Riters in Disguise?
>
>Sounds like a catchy name for a song, doesn't it?
>
>Actually this is my very uneducated hypothesis regarding style
>analysis: Is is possible that some N.T. authors, i.e.
>uneducated fishermen, or even a highly educated man concerned that
>every word written would be taken literally, would submit their
>writing to respected friends for comments and/or
>editing before sending them out to the general public.
>
>It is very common today. Why wouldn't it have been then?
>
>Depending on how many different people assisted or how much
>leeway they were offered in revising, the style of a single
>writer could appear to vary considerably even at the time
>of original publication, even before multitudes of helpful scribes
>were able to include their adjustments.
It is generally thought that NT writers used amanuenses to write down the text
which they dictated, especially in writing letters. This is often cited as a
factor to explain different styles, with the idea that the amanuenses reworded
the text as they wrote it down.
Given the relative difficulty and expense of writing in the ancient world, I
doubt that many people went through multiple drafts before sending a work out.
This would be more certain for letters than for gospels, however. Some have
suggested that the "Western" text of Acts represents a different draft by Luke
when compared with the more standard text. I forget which in this theory was
to be the final product. I guess I am sceptical of this theory.
Personally, I think that each person employs multiple styles, some better than
others, but each suited to the rhetorical situation and audience as the writer
sees it. That is true today and I imagine it was true in the past.
********************************************************************************
Bruce Terry E-MAIL: terry@bible.acu.edu
Box 8426, ACU Station Phone: 915/674-3759
Abilene, Texas 79699 Fax: 915/674-3769
********************************************************************************
------------------------------
From: Karen Pitts <karen_pitts@maca.sarnoff.com>
Date: 20 Sep 1995 10:55:22 U
Subject: RE- Accents
RE: Accents 9/20/95 10:43 AM
This will teach me to respond off the cuff after 10:00 at night.
For my students, I still think teaching accents is important, but I follow
what Carl Conrad mentioned. I teach verb accents, paying attention to where
the noun accents are and how they shift with long or short ending vowels, and
some enclitics, although mostly for recognition. My students are all adults
with full time jobs, families, or both, and everyone struggles to find time to
devote to Greek. We attempt to meet weekly, but don't do anything from
mid-Nov through Dec. or the summer. This means I get to do lots of review.
On the other hand, the ones who stick it out, do so because they believe that
knowing Greek, even at a first year level, will give them insight into the New
Testament, and they all are interested in knowing the Bible better. This
means that we do lots of things to reinforce Greek. Speaking (how do you
speak if you don't pay attention to accents? - but only using stresses, I
wouldn't know how to do pitches), writing on white boards, translating English
to Greek, coming up with silly pneumonics to remember vocab and paradigms.
For this approach, we need to know accents.
On the positive side, I was one of the guinea pigs for this class in 1992, and
have been meeting weekly with others to read the NT since August-September,
1992 (when I also took over teaching the beginning class). Our group is now
up to three lay people (all women, strangely enough) and our pastor. We've
read the first 6 chapters of Hebrews, the Gospel of John, Galatians, spot
readings through the other gospels, letters of Paul, Revelation, and parts of
the Septuagint. This fall we are going to read through the Gospel of Mark.
And I have the chutzpa to join the Biblical Greek reflector.
I still think accents are important.
Karen Pitts
------------------------------
From: perry.stepp@chrysalis.org
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 95 10:02:36 -0600
Subject: SYNOPTIC PROBLEM EXEGESIS RE
Regarding the John the Baptist narratives--
We (a Baylor Ph.D. seminar) are currently working through John P. Meier's *A
Marginal Jew* volume 2. Meier devotes 230 pages (80+ pages of endnotes) to
John the Baptist. He gives a fairly exhaustive discussion of these passages,
from a moderately conservative (that is: more "conservative" than Crossan, not
as "conservative" as F. F. Bruce or D. A. Carson) Catholic perspective. He may
not pay as much attention as others to the theological implications of Marcan
or Matthaean priority, however.
Perry L. Stepp, Baylor University
------------------------------
From: "Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 10:09:18 -0500
Subject: Re: Re- Teaching accents
At 9:34 AM 9/20/95, James D. Ernest wrote:
>On Wed, 20 Sep 1995, Carl W. Conrad wrote:
>
>> While it is certainly true that the accents help to distinguish words that
>> are spelled the same way, can anyone demonstrate any other value to
>> teaching them or writing them?
>
>Ritual/religious value. If Greek students aren't circumflexed
>by the 8th session, do they really have any share in the
>DIAQHKH? The pain may be acute, but skipping it is a grave
>error.
I DO see your point: the absence of a PERISPWMENON is the grammatical
equivalent of AKROBUSTIA! And what is the syntactical equivalent?
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University
One Brookings Drive, St. Louis, MO, USA 63130
(314) 935-4018
cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu OR cwc@oui.com
WWW: http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~cwconrad/
------------------------------
From: "Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 10:43:21 -0500
Subject: Re: RE- Accents
At 5:55 AM 9/20/95, Karen Pitts wrote:
>RE: Accents 9/20/95 10:43 AM
> This
>means that we do lots of things to reinforce Greek. Speaking (how do you
>speak if you don't pay attention to accents? - but only using stresses, I
>wouldn't know how to do pitches), writing on white boards, translating English
>to Greek, coming up with silly pneumonics to remember vocab and paradigms.
>For this approach, we need to know accents.
Now here I am 100% in agreement: students need to pronounce the words and
they need to read aloud and get the aural and vocal reinforcement of the
printed and visually apprehended words. And for this you need, quite
practically, a way to accent the words that is uniform whether it bears any
real relationship to the way ancient speakers of the language at any one
time and place pronounced it (and I am skeptical about being very precise
on the actual pronunciation at any one time and place in antiquity of
Greek). I don't even think which convention one uses is that important. I
use the traditional Erasmian pronunciation, not because I think it is
right, but because it is the one most likely to be understood by others who
have been taught Greek elsewhere (at least, elsewhere in the U.S., although
I know other pronunciations are practiced elsewhere).
But here's a challenge to accentual pronunciation: how do you pronounce a
word with a circumflex on the penult and an acute on the ultima and
followed by a string of enclitics, such as, for example:
ANQRW=PO/N TINA/ TI/ MOI EIPO/NTA
This only makes sense if you pronounce the omega of ANQRWPON with a rising,
then falling pitch on the omega and then with a rising pitch for each
successive acute. I'm assuming the theory that an acute represents a
musical 1/5 above the tone of the unaccented syllables (and a grave a
musical 1/3 above them, the circumflex a rising and falling 1/5 = 1/3).
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University
One Brookings Drive, St. Louis, MO, USA 63130
(314) 935-4018
cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu OR cwc@oui.com
WWW: http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~cwconrad/
------------------------------
From: Nichael Cramer <nichael@sover.net>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 13:03:15 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Spelling Anti-Flame [was: Accents]
On 20 Sep 1995, Karen Pitts wrote:
> [...] This
> means that we do lots of things to reinforce Greek. Speaking (how do you
> speak if you don't pay attention to accents? - but only using stresses, I
> wouldn't know how to do pitches), writing on white boards, translating English
> to Greek, coming up with silly pneumonics to remember vocab and paradigms.
^^^^^^^^^^
> For this approach, we need to know accents.
Please understand that this is in no way a flame. But the above was just
too wonderful to let pass.
Especially given the context, this has to stand as probably the most
delightful and all round coolest typo/spelling "error" that I've come
across.
On an otherwise dreary Weds afternoon in Vermont,
N
------------------------------
From: Westwinds1@aol.com
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 13:23:30 -0400
Subject: Trinity and Deity
I have had some experience with people involved in cults before but I have
just encounter a new twist. This fellow was at one time involved in The Way
International but came to the conclusion it was a cult and left. However he
is an adamant anti-trinitarian and flatly denies the deity of Christ. My
conclusion? He left the cult but apparently kept the doctrine. His claim?
Both doctrines are man made and the Council of Nicea was nothing but
Catholic propoganda.
Question-- is there a good text dealing with the greek N.T passages
concerning the deity of Christ. I have just ordered Murray Harris' monograph
on the topic. Any other suggestions? Also what is a good rigorous treatment
of the Trinity that would go beyond the typical Systematic Theologies? My
goal is not so much to take this guy on as these situations usually prove
frustratingly futile. I do feel the challenge to get razor sharp in my
thinking on these two areas. Thanks in advance for recommendations
Ron
------------------------------
From: David Moore <dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 10:35:40 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Re- Teaching accents
On Wed, 20 Sep 1995, Carl W. Conrad wrote:
> At 5:26 PM 9/19/95, Karen Pitts wrote:
> >On Tue, 19 Sep 1995, DR. KEN PULLIAM wrote:
> >
> >> I have a question for those who teach Koine Greek. How valuable
> >> is it for the first year student to be taught the rules for
> >> accenting?
> >
> >I've shephered two classes of adults through Koine Greek through our church
> >where what the seminary covers in a semester takes us 2 to 3 years. Believe
> >me, I try to keep it as simple as possible. I think accents are essential.
> >There are several words that differ only in accent. EI (if) without an
> >accent, and EI (you are) with a circumflex are examples of early vocab which
> >require knowing the accents. I don't think the accents are any more confusing
> >than conjugation for native English speakers, the concepts of tenses that
> >convey type of action rather than time, or the middle voice. At least accents
> >have fairly straightforward rules.
>
> I teach classical Attic mostly, but I am currently teaching Homeric in one
> class and Koine in tutorial. I always go through the accents carefully,
> tell students that they should learn the rules for accentuation of verbs
> and enclitics, and tell them that they OUGHT to memorize the place of
> accents on adjectives and nouns. I do think that it's important to get the
> accents right on the 3+ different senses of "H", two senses of "ARA", etc.
> On the other hand, I've never taken grades off for a missed accent on a
> paper. And the reason is a confession that I make to my classes but haven't
> really publicized: Some forty years ago in Munich I turned in a seminar
> paper on Aristophanes to Rudolf Pfeiffer and got back on it only one
> comment, "which, being interpreted, is": 'It's evident that you never
> really learned the accents on Greek; I suggest that you either get them
> right or omit them altogether!'
>
> While it is certainly true that the accents help to distinguish words that
> are spelled the same way, can anyone demonstrate any other value to
> teaching them or writing them? And perhaps more significantly, does anyone
> who teaches them also endeavor to teach a pronunciation in terms of a pitch
> accent, which is what the accents were really meant to illustrate? I
> imagine that most people teach students to use a stress accent on the
> syllable accented in the Greek word. I make one single effort to show
> students what the pitch accent MAY have sounded like (I don't really think
> we have anything but a theoretical conception of this, although I am aware
> that some scholars have prepared tapes of the PROPER pronunciation of the
> accents). In fact, I rather suspect that those of us who teach Greek and
> participate in this List use five or six different standards of
> pronunciation!
>
Just to add my .02, I don't teach the accents when teaching
beginning Greek. It is certainly helpful to know the accent system - but,
IMO, for the beginner, not necessary. For one thing, the texts available
for NT Greek in Spanish don't present a complete set of rules for
accentuation. I do teach the basic facts about the accent system, but
don't require that Greek words be accented in student papers and tests.
I refer students who may be interested in mastering the accent
system (and who have the requisite English skills) to D. A. Carson, _Greek
Accents: A student's Manual_ which gives an adequate treatment of the
subject.
Something to consider when discussing this matter is that the NT,
as originally penned, had no system of written accents; our oldest extant
MSS do not contain them either (except for those MSS where accents were
added later). Normally, the context tells how same-spelled words (What's
the TT for that?) should be understood and pronounced. For the beginner,
accents come in handy to avoid problems in the use of the lexicon, but a
little care and observation of the context can keep things on track.
Certainly, to go on in Greek, one must master accentuation, but,
IMO, it's a subject best studied in a more concentrated and complete manner
than its treatment in most grammars.
One more point: although the three forms of the accent are
preserved in Koine, our best info on pronunciation in that epoch
indicates that the tonal accent had become simply a stress accent by that
time.
David L. Moore Southeastern Spanish District
Miami, Florida of the Assemblies of God
dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Department of Education
------------------------------
From: Mobluffer@aol.com
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 14:06:52 -0400
Subject: unsubscribe
unsubscribe b-greek
------------------------------
From: Kenneth Litwak <kenneth@sybase.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 95 08:41:24 PDT
Subject: Re: Ghost Riters in Disguise?
There is, as a matter of fact, a fairly lengthy treatment, not of
Ghost writers, but of the role of the amanuensis in Hellenistic culture,
though I'm afraid at the moment the title escapes me. It does have the
word amanuensis in it, at least. The author argues that not only were
they commonly employed, but their freedom with regards to wording varied
greatly. Sometimes they acted as mere secretaries taking dictation.
At other times, they played more of an authorial role. It all depended
upon the requirements of whom they were writing for. Since it is the
case that apparently at least some NT letters were written by individuals
other than the author, e.g., 1 Peter, and since we don't know exactly
how free an amanuensis may have been in any particular context, it is a
very significant consideration when comparing two NT documents for
authorship. Certainly, I'm not advocating begging the question by
calling in an amanuensis to solve all difficulties, because I doubt
seriously that someone like Paul, who apparently had some sort of
Hellenistic education (though the extent is debatable), would have
exercised no editorial control over an amanuensis. It is, however, a
point to ponder when comparing the style of 1 Peter to 2 Peter, or
Romans to 1 Timothy. My personal view is that we know too little to make
dogmatic statements based upon style (sort of a Heisenberg-like view:
there's just too much uncertainty).
Ken Litwak
GTU
Bezerkley, CA
------------------------------
From: Paul Moser <PMOSER@cpua.it.luc.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 95 13:42 CDT
Subject: Calling Jesus "God" in the NT
Regarding the recent question whether the NT calls Jesus
"God", the following paper is admirably careful and
concise: Vincent Taylor, "Does the NT Call Jesus God?",
*Expository Times* 73 (Jan. 1962), 116-18. The popular
appeal to Rom 9:5, Titus 2:13, 2Pet 1:1, and Heb 1:8
leans on grammatical ambiguities unable to bear the
requisite theological weight. Taylor is sound on this
point, adding that "(Paul) will not compromise his
belief that God is one God, not even for Christ's
sake, and this is true also of the author of
Hebrews and John." Regarding Heb 1:8, the marginal
translation of the NRSV seems clearly preferable to
the translation in the text, especially after one
examines Psalm 45 in the LXX. The vocative of
"theos" is definitely not what the original context
supports. Jn 20:28 and Phil 2:6-9 do, however, offer
some evidence in the direction of later confessions--
on which see A.W. Wainwright, "The Confession 'Jesus is
God' in the NT," *Scottish Journal of Theology* 10
(1957), 274-99. The other relevant evidence is
surveyed in R.T. France, "The Worship of Jesus," in
*Christ the Lord*, ed. H. Rowdon (London, 1982), and
in R. Bauckham, "The Worship of Jesus...," NTS 27
(1980/81), 322-41. -- Paul Moser, Loyola University
of Chicago.
------------------------------
From: "Philip L. Graber" <pgraber@emory.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 14:48:21 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Re- Teaching accents
On Wed, 20 Sep 1995, David Moore wrote:
> Normally, the context tells how same-spelled words (What's
> the TT for that?)
homographs
Philip
Emory
------------------------------
From: Dennis Burke <dennisb@test490.pac.sc.ti.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 95 14:05:22 CDT
Subject: Q: Pronunciation
I have a pretty basic question. I'm still trying to teach myself New Testament
Greek and was wondering if there is a "standard" for pronunciation. I have
seen pronunciation listed in a couple of different books, but, obviously, since
I am asking this question, they were not the same. Can anyone provide me with
a URL or anonymous ftp site where a "standard" pronunciation is defined/listed?
Thanks!
Dennis Burke
------------------------------
From: David Moore <dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 15:06:03 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Trinity and Deity
On Wed, 20 Sep 1995 Westwinds1@aol.com wrote:
> I have had some experience with people involved in cults before but I have
> just encounter a new twist. This fellow was at one time involved in The Way
> International but came to the conclusion it was a cult and left. However he
> is an adamant anti-trinitarian and flatly denies the deity of Christ. My
> conclusion? He left the cult but apparently kept the doctrine. His claim?
> Both doctrines are man made and the Council of Nicea was nothing but
> Catholic propoganda.
>
> Question-- is there a good text dealing with the greek N.T passages
> concerning the deity of Christ. I have just ordered Murray Harris' monograph
> on the topic. Any other suggestions? Also what is a good rigorous treatment
> of the Trinity that would go beyond the typical Systematic Theologies? My
> goal is not so much to take this guy on as these situations usually prove
> frustratingly futile. I do feel the challenge to get razor sharp in my
> thinking on these two areas. Thanks in advance for recommendations
You might look into church history around the period of the Council of
Nicaea. The period following the Council is of special interest.
According to sources I've read, Constantinius, seeing that the orthodox
position was not supported by the majority, bowed to political pressure
and exiled the leaders of the Nicene position.
But when the Arians had fully come to power, it became apparent
that there were deep divisions among them concerning _where_ to situate
Christ on the scale between diety and humanity. Their differences became
so great that their administration failed, and the orthodox bishops were
recalled from exile to again take over pastoral care of the church.
I realize this post is somewhat off topic for this list, but
since we have dealt extensively with passages that are the basis of the
doctrines dealt with here, I hope no one objects to my citing some
historical background on this point.
David L. Moore Southeastern Spanish District
Miami, Florida of the Assemblies of God
dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Department of Education
------------------------------
From: Clint Gilliam <taza@nando.net>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 15:17:58 EST
Subject: Re: Re- Teaching accents
** Reply to note from David Moore <dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us> 09/20/95
10:35am -0400
> Certainly, to go on in Greek, one must master accentuation, but,
Can you enlighten me into this?
Clint Gilliam <taza@nando.net>
------------------------------
From: Stephen Carlson <scc@reston.icl.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 95 14:04:29 EDT
Subject: Re: RE- Accents
Carl W. Conrad wrote:
> But here's a challenge to accentual pronunciation: how do you pronounce a
> word with a circumflex on the penult and an acute on the ultima and
> followed by a string of enclitics, such as, for example:
>
> ANQRW=PO/N TINA/ TI/ MOI EIPO/NTA
No problem! I'm one of those people with the atrocious habit of
accenting my spoken Greek according to rules of Classical Latin. A
similar psychological process probably accounts for my pronouncing
Estonian with an Italian accent.
Stephen Carlson
- --
Stephen Carlson : Poetry speaks of aspirations, : ICL, Inc.
scc@reston.icl.com : and songs chant the words. : 11490 Commerce Park Dr.
(703) 648-3330 : Shujing 2:35 : Reston, VA 22091 USA
------------------------------
From: Travis Bauer <bauer@acc.jc.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 14:54:35 -35900
Subject: Re: Re- Teaching accents
I began learning Greek with Machen's text, which introduces accents
almost immediately. I appreciated it. I think I'd be frustrated to begin
learning Greek with a program that omits accents and then to begin reading
the New Testament with every word covered with something I didn't
understand (the accents). I would have wondered what other basic component
of the language I hadn't been introduced to. It would have lowered my
confidence.
/-----------------------------------------------------------------
/ Travis Bauer / If all the world's philosophers were laid /
/ Jamestown College / end to end, would they reach a conclusion? /
- -----------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: Frank Thielman <FSTHIELM%SAMFORD.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 95 14:49:23 CDT
Subject: unsubscribe
unsubscribe
------------------------------
From: Frank Thielman <FSTHIELM%SAMFORD.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 95 14:53:45 CDT
Subject: unsubscribe
unsubscribe b-greek
------------------------------
From: Les Ballard <lesball@beacon.regent.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 17:07:01 -0400
Subject: unsubscribe
Please unsubscribe me.
------------------------------
From: Kenneth Litwak <kenneth@sybase.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 95 14:31:49 PDT
Subject: Re: Q: Pronunciation
> I have a pretty basic question. I'm still trying to teach myself New Testament
> Greek and was wondering if there is a "standard" for pronunciation. I have
> seen pronunciation listed in a couple of different books, but, obviously, since
> I am asking this question, they were not the same. Can anyone provide me with
> a URL or anonymous ftp site where a "standard" pronunciation is defined/listed?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dennis Burke
>
Dennis,
I wouldn't sweat which system of pronunciation you choose. It
probably doesn't correspond with how Greek was pronounced in NT times,
if there was a standard unaffected by geography. In any case, the
pronunciation system we use, which I got from Machen's grammar, comes
ultimately from Erasmus, and he may in fact have been playing a
practical joke on the academic world by presenting a system he knew
not to be correct. Certainly also our pronunciation does not match
modern Greek either, in which, I'm told, one would say "vlepo", not
"blepo".
Ken Litwak
GTU
Bezerkley, CA
------------------------------
End of b-greek-digest V1 #866
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