From: David Moore (dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us)
Date: Fri Jan 12 1996 - 17:16:36 EST
Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu> wrote:
>At 2:50 PM 1/12/96, Bruce Terry wrote:
>>On Fri, 12 Jan 1996, Carl W. Conrad wrote:
>>
>>>At 1:38 PM 1/12/96, Bruce Terry wrote:
>>>>On Thu, 11 Jan 1996, Kenneth Litwak wrote (in part):
>>>>
>>>>>4. Finally, II:7 says ou mishseis panta anqrwpou. I think this says
>>>>>"You shall not hate every person", while Lightfoot translates it as
>>>>>"thou shalt not hate any man". I don't think I accept translating pas as
>>>>>"any". that's what tis is for. Comments?
>>>>
>>>>The rule of thumb here is to translate PAS as "any" when used with a
>>>>negative.
>>>>This is because Greek PAS is used with different meaning than English "all"
>>>>with negatives. If you translate this, "You shall not hate every person,"
>>>>some English speaker is bound to say, "I don't hate every person; it's just
>>>>so-and-so that I hate."
>>>
>>>Nevertheless, Bruce, I think this must be a Semitism. In Attic Greek PANTA
>>>ANQRWPON used thus would have to mean "every person." I really think this
>>>derives from Hebrew QOL's usage. BDF note this as "Hebraizing" at #302.
>>
>>My point, Carl, is that the English is capable of sustaining two meanings, one
>>of which I don't think the Greek contains (but perhaps I am wrong; you have
>>read much more extensively in Classical Greek than I). English "every person"
>>can mean not only "each and every person" viewed individually (i.e. "each and
>>every person you shall not hate" or "you shall not hate any person at all"),
>>but also "all the people" viewed collectively ("you shall not hate every
>>single last person" or "you shall not hate the sum total of the people"). If
>>I am not mistaken, the Greek only allows the former. The reason for
>>translating PAS as "any" does not have to do with what Greek or Hebrew means,
>>but with the ambiguity in the English. Does this ambiguity also exist in the
>>Greek? Can PANTA ANQRWPON mean "all the people" as English can?
>>
>>The meaning is obviously the former in the passage at hand, but the convention
>>of translating PAS as "any" is to reduce the ambiguity and keep some wit from
>>taking the other possible meaning in English.
>
>I think I see your point, but I wonder whether you're expressing it as
>clearly as it might be put (more likely I'm misunderstanding, I guess). Is
>it really that _English_ is capable of sustaining two meanings or that the
>Greek PAS is thus capable. It seems to me that English normally uses
>either the indirect article (a, an) or "any," which, I think, is another
>form of the indirect article) to express what Greek normally expresses
>using TIS. PAS in Greek normally expresses wholeness singly or plurally. I
>think it's where the Hellenistic or specifically Hebraizing Greek uses PAS
>for "any" that English-speakers have problems. The phrase we have in the
>Didache above,
>OU MISHSEIS PANTA ANQRWPON is, in fact, not "normal idiomatic Greek"--not
>even, I believe, normal Hellenistic idiomatic Greek. Rather one would find
>OU MH MISHSHiS MHDENA ANQRWPON (in fact, I think that even the use of the
>future indicative with MH is a Semitism). So I think it's the use of PAS
>in the Greek that's the anomaly, rather than something ambiguous in
>English.
This construction, PAS...OU (MH), sounds idiomatic to me because
my reading has been mainly in the NT and collaterally in the LXX. (I
understand the passage from the Didache as, "You shall not hate anyone.")
But it is identified as "Biblical" Greek by Turner (Mouton's grammar,
III:196), and he says that it comes from the Hebrew LO'...KOL = KOL...LO',
which is used idiomatically just as PAS...OU in biblical Greek.
Turner cites Mat. 24:22; Mk 13:30, OUK AN ESWQH PASA SARC, Jn.
12:46 PAS hO PISTEUWN...MH MEINHi, and many other illustrations of the
construction (_Ibid._).
David L. Moore Southeastern Spanish District
Miami, Florida of the Assemblies of God
dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Department of Education
http://members.aol.com/dvdmoore
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.4 : Sat Apr 20 2002 - 15:37:35 EDT