From: Carl W. Conrad (cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu)
Date: Sun Jan 18 1998 - 09:00:14 EST
At 9:07 PM -0600 1/17/98, Steven Cox wrote:
> Carl, and anyone else.
> I have heard of "already/not yet" as a hermeneutic
> concept, but have no (conscious) experience of
> applying it at a grammatical level. Are there
> distinctions of tense, mood or aspect which would help
> to identify an "already/not yet" meaning or is it
> entirely contextual?
>
> Is "already/not yet" also present in classical greek?
> Regards
> Steven
This is not the forum for a discussion of hermeneutics or of NT eschatology
in general; what I offered and you have cited from below should be viewed
as no more (or less) than my own perspective on this matter of
eschatological consummation in NT literature; I'm not attacking alternative
views nor am I ready to offer any defense of my own perspective here. But
for clarification's sake, let me say that eschatological thinking is alien
to the "classical Greek" mindset--if I may use so loose a phrase; rather
that mindset tends much more to view time as cyclical and sequences of
events as likely to recur (more or less) over long periods of time in the
same manner that the seasons recur from year to year. Eschatological
thinking in terms of linear movement from divine creation through
vicissitudes of human history to an ultimate consummation in accordance
with God's will is distinctly Hebraic, although something like it shows up
elsewhere and although the sharper outlines of such a conception seem
really to derive originally from the Persian Zarathustra and to have
exercised powerful influence over many ancient religious traditions. Having
said that much, I would only add that it seems to me that the NT in several
texts restates again and again the notion that in some sense God has
already acted decisively in human affairs in the event of the ministry,
crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Chirst but that what God has thus
begun will be consummated in a final victory and actualization of God's
reign/kingdom at some point sooner or later in the future. One of the most
succinct formulations of it is Rom 8:24 in the little phrase THi GAR ELPIDI
ESWQHMEN, where the aorist ESWQHMEN expresses, I would say, the FACT of our
salvation, while THi ELPIDI makes it clear that our salvation has not yet
come but awaits complete fruition in the future.
I've tried to offer one simple illustration at the verse level and to show
how it CAN be looked at there, but the larger argument doesn't belong here
because it has to do with larger issues of NT interpretation rather than
with issues of how the Greek text is to be understood.
>At 06:54 98/01/17 -0600, Carl W. Conrad wrote:
>>At 1:28 AM -0600 1/17/98, Steven Cox wrote:
>>> Hello b-greekers
>>>
>>> INA KATARGHSHi ..TON DIABOLON (Heb2:14)
>>>
>>> INA ELEHMWN GENHTAI KAI PISTOS ARCIEREUS (Heb2:17)
>>>
><snip>
>>NT eschatological assertions are going to be problematic, I think, with
>>respect to assertions of fulfilment. One can readily point to a verse like
>>John 12:31 NUN KRISIS ESTIN TOU KOSMOU TOUTOU: NUN hO ARCWN TOU KOSMOU
>>TOUTOU EKBLHQHSETAI EXW and one can construct an argument (one with which I
>>tend to agree) that the time reference implied by the NUN and the future
>>perfect EKBLHQHESETAI in John's gospel is the crucifixion and resurrection
>>of Jesus envisioned as a single whole event. BUT, I don't think one can
>>rely upon that alone; I think one must consider the gospel of John as a
>>whole, and it seems to me that if one considers the gospel of John as a
>>whole, one finds in it assertions,both (a) that the key eschatological
>>event has ALREADY taken place, and (b) that it REMAINS to be consummated
>>fully in the FUTURE. And my own sense of the NT literature is that this
>>bipolarity of an ALREADY and a NOT-YET is pretty consistent and to be found
>>throughout the NT, regardless of whether there's an emphasis on realized or
>>upon futuristic eschatology in any particular text.
>>
>>Carl W. Conrad
>>Department of Classics/Washington University
>>One Brookings Drive/St. Louis, MO, USA 63130/(314) 935-4018
>>Home: 7222 Colgate Ave./St. Louis, MO 63130/(314) 726-5649
>>cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu OR cconrad@yancey.main.nc.us
>>WWW: http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~cwconrad/
>>
>>
>>
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics/Washington University
One Brookings Drive/St. Louis, MO, USA 63130/(314) 935-4018
Home: 7222 Colgate Ave./St. Louis, MO 63130/(314) 726-5649
cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu OR cconrad@yancey.main.nc.us
WWW: http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~cwconrad/
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