RE: Ephesians ~ Present Perfect

From: Carl W. Conrad (cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu)
Date: Tue Apr 27 1999 - 19:32:51 EDT

<x-rich>At 5:32 PM -0500 4/27/99, Bill Ross wrote:

<excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>{Bill}

I *really* want to put this thing to bed, but it is so interesting and
instructive that I can't seem to do it. (This is how the book of Job
got so long).

</color></fontfamily>

{<fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>Carl}

</color></fontfamily>And that is that this is a PRESENT PERFECT tense
form; <fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>

</color></fontfamily>

<fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>{Bill}

Is this to be distinguished from the PERFECT?

</color></fontfamily></excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>

</color></fontfamily>No, they're the same thing--but properly speaking
"perfect" is an aspect, and there is a Present Perfect, a Past Perfect
(or pluperfect), and a rare but nevertheless real Future Perfect.

<excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>{Carl}

</color></fontfamily>That's my point: you cannot isolate the ESTE from
SESWiSMENOI and deem it to have a meaning in the Greek here all by
itself. It just doesn't have that meaning by itself; it has it only in
conjunction with the
participle.<fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>

</color></fontfamily>

<fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>{Bill}</color></fontfamily>

<fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>SESWiSMENOI without
ESTE is grammatically incorrect because the proper form includes EIMI,
because of the awkward morphology of conjugating it without it?

</color></fontfamily></excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>

</color></fontfamily>That's right on target.

<excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>SESWiSMENOI without
ESTE is sort of like saying "you saved" when you mean "you are
saved" (but in Greek should be "you are been saved")?

</color></fontfamily></excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>

</color></fontfamily>But in English we'd use "have" where Greek uses
"are": "You have been saved."

<excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>I
 think I'm getting it.

</color></fontfamily></excerpt><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,FFFF</param>

</color></fontfamily>I'm reminded of the old Danny Kaye movie, "The
Court Jester," that had a recurrent sequence of lessons and responses
that went:

--"Get it?"

--"Got it!"

--"Good!"

And I think that's a good place to call a halt to this.

Carl W. Conrad

Department of Classics/Washington University

One Brookings Drive/St. Louis, MO, USA 63130/(314) 935-4018

Home: 7222 Colgate Ave./St. Louis, MO 63130/(314) 726-5649

cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu

WWW: http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~cwconrad/

</x-rich>

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