From: Joe A. Friberg (JoeFriberg@email.msn.com)
Date: Tue Dec 21 1999 - 23:38:38 EST
Thank you, Paul for bringing up this alternative interpretation of v35a; yet
though I can follow the logic of the argument as you see it, I do not see
that the grammar structures the flow of the thought to fit your
interpretation:
> > Paul Dixon (PD):
> > > > << whoever desires to save his life (eternally) shall lose it
> (temporally)
vs. (Gundry, Steven Craig Miller, Joe A Friberg)
'whoever wishes to save his (present) life shall lose it (eternally)'
> Yes, the more common interpretation of v. 35 is as you say, Joe. But,
> let me
> point out some serious problems with that view.
>
> First, it ignores the parallel with the immediately preceding verse. The
> GAR of
> v. 35 seems to be introducing an explanation of v. 34.
Sort-of. GAR introduces support, not necessarily an explanation: it could
as readily introduce a *motivation grounds* for heeding Christ's invitation
to follow him (see next comment).
> If so, then the
> protasis-apodosis
> of v. 35 runs parallel to and explains the protasis-apodosis of v. 34.
No! v35a stands as a *warning* against the main temptation and obstacle
that would draw disciples away from or keep them from following Jesus: the
desire to preserve their own lives rather than to lay them down in
sacrifice. Jesus has called them to self-sacrifice, then warns them against
the lure of self-preservation.
> In v. 34 EI TIS QELEI OPISW MOU AKOLOUQEITW is paralleled and explained
> by hOS GAR EAN QELHi THN YUCHN AUTOU SWSAI. How can a desire to follow
> Christ be explained as a desire to save one's present life, that is a
> desire to gain
> and keep the things of this world (cf 37-38)? Much better is the notion
> that a desire
> to follow Christ is explained as a desire to save one's life.
Nowhere in this whole passage to follow does Jesus advocate seeking anything
for one's self, not even eternal life, for that would be a selfish end. The
passage is about self-sacrifice (v34), followed by multiple warnings about
the futility of trying to save one's self, no matter what way they try to
slice their self-interest. Discipleship through self-sacrifice stands
contra:
v35a saving one's own life
v36 gaining the whole world (to buy soul/freedom?)
v37 any possible thing to buy soul/freedom
v38 shame (for self-preservation)
> Joe, you argued that such a position would then view the losing of one's
> temporal life as a means to the end, the end being salvation, the
> apparent
> conflict being a denial of a particular doctrine.
No, my disagreement is not on doctrinal grounds, for I do not regard these
verses as primarily doctrinal, but rhetorical. Most of Jesus' words (in all
4 gospels) are not primarily doctrinal/expository, but hortatory.
I do not think the grammar of his persuasive argument supports your
interpretation. I do not think the grammar of v35a can support the
interpretation as Purpose-Means, nor do I think that the grammar supports
the parallels you draw with v34.
Note the particles, pronouns, mood, and tense used in these verses:
v34
EI TIS QELEI -ind. pres.
APARNHSASQW -imp. aor.
ARATW -imp.aor.
AKOLOUQEITW -imp. pr.
v35
hOS GAR EAN QELHi -subj pr.
APOLESEI -ind. fut.
hOS D' AN APOLESEI -ind. fut.
SWSEI -ind. fut.
v36
TI GAR WFELEI -ind. pr.
v37
TI GAR DOI -subj aor.
v38
hOS GAR EAN EPAISXUNWHi -subj aor.
EPAISXUNQHSETAI -ind. fut.
Observations:
- The Purpose-Means construction in v34 uses imperatives to urge wanna-be
disciples to engage in the means to the end.
- The consturction of v35a is absent any such imperatival constructions.
The
ind. fut. can hardly be expected to carry the weight of a strong
exhortation.
- The EAN-subjunctive construction (v35a) points to what is ideally an
irrealis
condition--it is NOT an ideal to be sought but to be avoided! Note the same
construction is used in v38 to identify the behavior Jesus is warning
against.
- In sum, the grammar of v35a parallels v38, NOT v34.
- The indicative future in v35b points to a future potentiality that is to
be
accepted if it comes. If it comes, a promise follows!
- The DE in the middle of v35 points to contrast between the two halves of
the
verse. Thus the conjunction reinforces the contrast in grammar, etc.
- In v37, the sujunctive emphasizes the impossibility of coming up with a
good enough answer!
- Each of vv35-38 is connected with GAR. This conjunction may connect each
verse with the immediately preceding verse, but moreover, it connexts each
with the initial commands given in v34. That is, this string of GAR-clauses
serves as a string of four supporting grounds for why a person should follow
the stringent discipleship requirements of Jesus.
> Thanks for this most stimulating discussion.
>
> Paul Dixon
>
And thanks to you as well.
God bless you!
Joe A. Friberg
--- B-Greek home page: http://sunsite.unc.edu/bgreek You are currently subscribed to b-greek as: [cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu] To unsubscribe, forward this message to leave-b-greek-329W@franklin.oit.unc.edu To subscribe, send a message to subscribe-b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.4 : Sat Apr 20 2002 - 15:40:50 EDT