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b-greek-digest V1 #94
b-greek-digest Tuesday, 30 January 1996 Volume 01 : Number 094
In this issue:
Re: Greek fonts
Greek fonts
curses
Future subjunctive
Re: Greek fonts
Re: Greek fonts
Re: Future subjunctive
Re: Greek fonts
Re: I Sam 1 questions (Divine name in LXX)
Re: Greek fonts
Re: Future subjunctive
Re: Greek fonts
"=future subjunctive!"
Re: Greek fonts
Re: Future subjunctive
Interested in the new Greek text?
help on graphe artios (fwd)
Help with a word.
Matt 1:19
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Will Wagers <wagers@computek.net>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 00:00:42 -0600
Subject: Re: Greek fonts
Paul J. Bodin writes:
>I don't know where you got your information, but electronic fonts are
>definitely copyrightable and many of them are copyrighted.
Apparently, it is not as clear cut as you imagine. Apparently, type faces
are not protected by copyright law. But, there are tricks authors can use
to bring them under the law. (Have you noticed than many manufacturers
distribute the fonts free, but charge for the software to use them?) Or, so
I read anyway. I wish I had kept the FAQ I read, so I could pass it on, but
it fell to the disk space axe. Anyone who creates fonts for a living would,
naturally, like us to think it is a cut and dried matter (and we may hear
from them to that effect). In other countries, other laws apply. In the
absence of detailed knowledge, your rule of thumb is the safest. (It might
be like the people who say "legally" we are not bound to pay income taxes,
many of whom are in jail or ruined.) Who wants to hire a lawyer over a font
even if they are right?
Software can be, as you point out, protected by copyright in the U.S. - a very
weak and difficult to assert case (Apple vs. Microsoft), most often succeeding
only in cases of outright piracy.
In both these instances and in trademark law, the manufacturer is often so
ignorant of the law as to obviate the protection they could have had. (Notice
how some manufacturers put a tiny "TM" next to their trade name *on* the
product.)
>Distribution of copyrighted materials without permission is a criminal offense.
No, unauthorized and illegal copying of copyrighted material is an offense. I
can buy ten copies of the new LSJ and give them to you gentlemen without
fear. Also, the material must be covered by copyright case law, not just have
"Copyright" written on it. You can't copyright a pair of pliers.
>If your concern is using Perseus on the web, I seem to remember a
>posting in the not-to-distant past that gave instructions for obtaining
>and installing the needed fonts. Perhaps if you check the archive that
>James Tauber maintains you will run across the instructions.
It is and thanks for the info. I will look it up. Thanks also to Mr. Krentz.
Will
------------------------------
From: "Maurice A. O'Sullivan" <mauros@iol.ie>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 09:41:39 +0000
Subject: Greek fonts
Go to: http://rampages.onramp.net/~jbaima/
This is the Silver Mountain Software Home Page and John Baima has included:
" The Sgreek Fixed font can be used to display Greek with the online
documents from the Perseus project."
The zipped file is about 25Kb.
Enjoy!
Maurice
Maurice A. O'Sullivan [ Bray, Ireland ]
mauros@iol.ie
[using Eudora Pro v 2.2 ]
------------------------------
From: Shaughn Daniel <shaughn.daniel@student.uni-tuebingen.de>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 11:36:18 +0100
Subject: curses
Hello there, I am excited at discovering the following verse. I wanted to
drop it here for any of your comments:
Aeschines Against Ctesiphon 110
(perseus reference: aeschin. 3.110):
[110] They were not content with taking
this oath, but they added an imprecation
and a mighty curse concerning this (ALLA KAI
PROSTROPHN KAI ARAN ISCURAN UPER TOUTWN EPOIHSANTO);
for it stands thus written in the curse
(GEGRAPTAI GAR OUTWS EN TH ARA): "If any
one should violate this," it says, "whether
city or private man, or tribe, let them be
under the curse," (EI TIS TADE PARABAINOI
H POLIS I IDIITHS H EQNOS, ENAGHS ESTW)
it says, "of Apollo and
Artemis and Leto and Athena Pronaea."
Gal. 1.9 "If anybody is preaching to you a
gospel other than what you accepted,
let him be under the curse" (EI TIS UMAS
EUAGGELIZETAI PAR O PARELABETE, ANATHEMA ESTW)
Some thoughts from my fuller thesis concerning ANATHEMA: ANATHEMA in Gal.
1.8f is to be understood as a "curse" which would have effectively
"expelled" the opponents in Galatians, thus it would be equal to
APOSYNAGWGOS, but in the context of the church, a gospel which entails
blessings and curses, and Paul's self-understanding as the Apostle to the
Gentiles. The literary background for Paul's ANATHEMA is to be found
directly in the vocabulary of the LXX, primarily in the context of the ban.
Supposed LXX coinage is supported by two arguments: 1. the absence of
ANATHEMA as "curse" from classical sources up to the time of the LXX and 2.
the all but complete absence of ANATHEMA in literature after the time of
the LXX (ANATHEMA is found in only 2 sources (of some 588 hits!) outside
Jewish/Christian literature).
I still have many nagging questions: what is the normative term in
classical Greek for "curse"--ENAGHS or EPARATOS or something else? What I
mean by "normative" is a term that is purely only negative, not something
like ARA which can be "prayer" in certain contexts and "curse" in others.
Ro 9.3 is given frequently as a parallel to Gal 1.9
based on the ANAQEMA where Paul exclames of his
Jewish brothers, "For I could wish that I myself
were cursed [ANAQEMA] and cut off from Christ
for the sake of my brothers...." In addition to this,
the ANAQEMA of Ro 9.3 is conceptually combined
with Ex 32.32, the concept of "to blot from a book" where
Moses prays for his people. Looking at Ro 9 as a whole
lends itself to that place in Scripture, for there is
a. reference to "the receiving of the law" (9.4), b. the whole
is a major discussion of understanding the term "Israel",
and c. Ex 33.19 is quoted at 9.15 with the introductory
phrase "For He says to Moses,...."
It has been defended in a few works that Gal reveals
a vocabulary of the prophets in their self-description.
Paul's "in the belly" passage in Ga 1.15 has been
seen as parallel to Jeremiah's vocabulary in his calling.
Hence, Paul's self-understanding is influenced by
his reading of the LXX, of which Jeremiah is a figure
which Paul records his own experience with.
The Romans 9 passage may serve as Paul's self-understanding
in the light of Moses and the giving of the law. Just as
Moses has understood the implications of breaking God's law,
so has Paul understood the implications of breaking the gospel
which he preaches and prays with the same attitude of Moses for
his people.
Sincerely,
Shaughn Daniel
Tuebingen, Germany
------------------------------
From: Mark O'Brien <Mark_O'Brien@dts.edu>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 96 10:48:33 CST
Subject: Future subjunctive
I was recently reading some comments regarding the existence of the future
subjunctive in one of the readings for 1Co 13:12, and I was thinking of doing a
little digging in this area. Can anybody supply me some brief background info
on the history of the future subjunctive in Greek? Thanks for your input. (I
apologize if this has been dealt with in previous discussion.)
Mark O'Brien
Grad. student, Dallas Theological Seminary
- ----
"There isn't much traffic on the extra mile..."
------------------------------
From: Stephen C Carlson <scarlso1@osf1.gmu.edu>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 09:49:51 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Greek fonts
Paul J. Bodin wrote:
>If your concern is using Perseus on the web, I seem to remember a
>posting in the not-to-distant past that gave instructions for obtaining
>and installing the needed fonts. Perhaps if you check the archive that
>James Tauber maintains you will run across the instructions.
I have saved and marked-up (with links, too) John Baima's (Silver
Mountain Software's guru) announcement, which explains how to get
his font and use it with Perseus, to one my web pages:
http://osf1.gmu.edu/~scarlso1/greek/wwwgkfnt.html
Stephen Carlson
- --
Stephen C. Carlson, George Mason University School of Law, Patent Track, 4LE
scarlso1@osf1.gmu.edu : Poetry speaks of aspirations, and songs
http://osf1.gmu.edu/~scarlso1/ : chant the words. -- Shujing 2.35
------------------------------
From: Stephen C Carlson <scarlso1@osf1.gmu.edu>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 12:30:08 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Greek fonts
Will Wagers wrote:
>>Distribution of copyrighted materials without permission . . .
>
>No, unauthorized and illegal copying of copyrighted material is an offense. I
>can buy ten copies of the new LSJ and give them to you gentlemen without
>fear.
"Public distribution" is protected by copyright [17 U.S.C. $ 106(3)] but
is subject to the "first sale doctrine" [17 U.S.C. $ 109], to which you
were alluding. The first sale doctrine does not grant anyone the right
to make additional copies which is generally the concern when dealing
with computerized material. For specific questions about specific factual
situations, one really should consult a competent copyright attorney.
Stephen Carlson
- --
Stephen C. Carlson, George Mason University School of Law, Patent Track, 4LE
scarlso1@osf1.gmu.edu : Poetry speaks of aspirations, and songs
http://osf1.gmu.edu/~scarlso1/ : chant the words. -- Shujing 2.35
------------------------------
From: "Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 11:39:48 -0600
Subject: Re: Future subjunctive
On 1/29/96, Mark O'Brien wrote:
> I was recently reading some comments regarding the existence of the future
> subjunctive in one of the readings for 1Co 13:12, and I was thinking of
>doing a
> little digging in this area. Can anybody supply me some brief background info
> on the history of the future subjunctive in Greek? Thanks for your input. (I
> apologize if this has been dealt with in previous discussion.)
I'm curious where you may have read anything about a future subjunctive as
such. No such animal is generally held to exist, at least in Attic or
Hellenistic Greek. What MAY be referred to is either of two phenomena:
(1) In Homeric Greek the subjunctive (whether with short vowels -- O/E-- or
long vowels --W/H--) is quite commonly used to express intention regarding
the future, but this is NOT called a future tense as such.
(2) It is almost certain that the historical form of the future tense with
a sigma followed by O/E thematic endings derives from use of the aorist
subjunctive to express future intention in the construction noted as common
in Homer. But this is a new formation, and it is certainly never called a
"future subjunctive."
One does find in Hellenistic Greek the future indicative 2 sg. used as an
imperative, as in LXX formulation of the Ten Commandments. I've always
thought this was a Semitism, but I'm not sure that it really is.
I don't see anything in 1 Cor 13:12 that's a candidate other than
EPIGNWSOMAI, and that's a garden-variety future indicative 1 sg.
I don't know when the following originally began to emerge, but Modern
Greek does use the subjunctive with QA (= QELW NA <-- QELW hINA) to express
the future tense; in fact, it has two aspects in the future: continuous
(using QA + present subjunctive) and aoristic (using QA + aorist
subjunctive). I suppose the linguists might prefer to call these two
futures "marked" and "unmarked."
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University
One Brookings Drive, St. Louis, MO, USA 63130
(314) 935-4018
cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu OR cwc@oui.com
WWW: http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~cwconrad/
------------------------------
From: "Paul J. Bodin" <pjbodin@sirius.com>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 96 10:08:21 EST
Subject: Re: Greek fonts
On Mon, 29 Jan 1996, Will Wagers wrote:
>Paul J. Bodin writes:
>
>>I don't know where you got your information, but electronic fonts are
>>definitely copyrightable and many of them are copyrighted.
>
>Apparently, it is not as clear cut as you imagine. Apparently, type faces
>are not protected by copyright law.
Ahh, I see you did not read my message very carefully. Typefaces are
usually not protected by copyright law--most are in the public domain.
Electronic fonts are not merely typefaces, however, and original work is
copyrightable.
Buying ten copies of LSJ and giving them to friends is not unauthorized
distribution--when you buy a copy you pay the copyright holder for the
privilege of doing as you please with the copy you purchase as long as
you don't duplicate any portion beyond "fair use".
_______________________________________________________________________
Paul J. Bodin Internet: pjbodin@sirius.com
Seminary Pastor smail: 1333 66th Street
Pacific Lutheran Theological Seminary Berkeley, CA 94702
------------------------------
From: "Wes C. Williams" <71414.3647@compuserve.com>
Date: 29 Jan 96 14:27:26 EST
Subject: Re: I Sam 1 questions (Divine name in LXX)
Summary: The LXX copies in pre-Christian times retained the divine name.
The evidence is that the substitution of YHWH for Kyrios in LXX copies began
after the first century C.E. (or perhaps late first century).
Ken asked:
>> Now, I've noticed in 1 Sam 1 that the translator often transliterates
>> divine titles, rather than translating them like KURION SABAWQ. I'm
wondering
>> if list members think the LXX in these cases would similarly be
transliterated
>> (and this makes me doubt the Hebrew knowledge of the LXX translator, along
>> with other things he/she did) or whether it is preferable to render words
>> like ELWAI and SABAWQ with a real translation of the Hebrew word?
Carl responded:
> By "the translator" I assume you mean the LXX translator, not the KJV
> translator. Don't we often in the English versions also keep a word like
> SABAOTH or ELWAI? My guess, however (and it is only a guess; I've read a
> fair amount of LXX but not studied it), is that it is the
> by-then-established Jewish reverence for the name of God (such as even
> makes one say "ha Shem" instead of pronouncing "Yahweh") that accounts for
> the transliteration of ELWAI and SABAWQ and the conversion of YHWH to the
> Greek KURIOS which represents the Hebrew word "Adonai" which is
> _pronounced_ when the word YHWH is encountered in the Hebrew text.
Carl is right. The later LXX translators knew where the divine name occurred
and substituted Kyrios. However, this was not true of the earlier LXX
translators since the earlier LXX fragments retain the tetragrammaton (YHWH) in
the midst of the Greek. Here is some research I am happy to share on the
subject. As I understand it, the real question is: "Should we today still abide
by the Jewish "reverence" and substitute the divine name for Kyrios, or
transliterate it in translation?"
- --------------------------------------------
The Fouad 266 papyri (Greek) were prepared in the second or the first century
B.C.E. Over 30 times the copyist putin the midst of the Greek writingthe
Tetragrammaton in Hebrew letters.
Dr. Paul E. Kahle of Oxford explained that these fragments contain "perhaps the
most perfect Septuagint text of Deuteronomy that has come down to us." In Studia
Patristica, he added, "We have here in a papyrus scroll a Greek text which
represents the text of the Septuagint in a more reliable form than Codex
Vaticanus and was written more than 400 years before." And it retained God's
personal name, as did the Greek fragments of the Twelve Prophets from the Judean
desert. Both agreed.
In the Journal of Biblical Literature (Vol. 79, pp. 111-118), Dr. Kahle surveyed
the accumulating evidence regarding the use of the divine name among the Jews
and concluded:
"All Greek translations of the Bible made by Jews for Jews in pre-Christian
times must have used, as the name of God, the Tetragrammaton in Hebrew
characters and not [Kyrios], or abbreviations of it, such as we find in the
Christian" copies of the Septuagint.
George Howard, associate professor of religion at the University of Georgia,
reported in the Journal of Biblical Literature. (Vol. 96, No. 1, 1977, pp.
63-83) His article begins:
"Recent discoveries in Egypt and the Judean Desert allow us to see first hand
the use of God's name in pre-Christian times."
He then discussed some recently (with respect to 1977) published Greek texts
from the pre-Christian period. Regarding the previously accepted view that in
the Septuagint the Greek title Kyrios was always substituted for God's name, we
read:
"From these findings we can now say with almost absolute certainty that the
divine name, YHWH, was not rendered by [Kyrios] in the pre-Christian Greek
Bible, as so often has been thought."
What about the general mass of Dead Sea Scrolls? Professor Howard writes:
"Perhaps the most significant observation we can draw from this pattern of
variegated usage of the divine name is that the Tetragram was held to be very
sacred. . . . In copying the biblical text itself the Tetragram was carefully
guarded. This protection of the Tetragram was extended even to the Greek
translation of the biblical text."
What about the LXX during the time of Christ and the apostles?
Professor Howard explains:
"Since the Tetragram was still written in the copies of the Greek Bible which
made up the Scriptures of the early church, it is reasonable to believe that the
N[ew] T[estament] writers, when quoting from Scripture, preserved the Tetragram
within the biblical text. On the analogy of pre-Christian Jewish practice we can
imagine that the NT text incorporated the Tetragram into its OT quotations."
"Thus somewhere around the beginning of the second century the use of surrogates
[substitutes for God's name] must have crowded out the Tetragram in both
Testaments. Before long the divine name was lost to the Gentile church
altogether except insofar as it was reflected in the contracted surrogates or
occasionally remembered by scholars."
Here are the instances in Deuteronomy where the divine name occurs in the Fouad
266 papyri:
LXXP. Fouad Inv. 266 renders the divine name by the Tetragrammaton written in
square Hebrew characters (YHWH) in the following places: De 18:5, 5, 7, 15, 16;
De 19:8, 14; De 20:4, 13, 18; De 21:1, 8; De 23:5; De 24:4, 9; De 25:15, 16; De
26:2, 7, 8, 14; De 27:2, 3, 7, 10, 15; De 28:1, 1, 7, 8, 9, 13, 61, 62, 64, 65;
De 29:4, 10, 20, 29; De 30:9, 20; De 31:3, 26, 27, 29; De 32:3, 6, 19.
Therefore, in this collection the Tetragrammaton occurs 49 times in identified
places in Deuteronomy. In addition, in this collection the Tetragrammaton occurs
three times in unidentified fragments, namely, in fragments 116, 117 and 123.
This papyrus, found in Egypt, was dated to the first century B.C.E.
In the interests of brevity, Ill stop here. Upon request, I can forward many
more examples of the divine name rendered in various LXX fragments and papyrii.
But to answer the question; since the Tetragrammaton was originally there and
substituted, and we in the list are likely not subject to the misapplied
reverence (superstition), I would move for the transliteration/ translation and
not for Kyrios.
Sincerely,
Wes Williams
------------------------------
From: "Maurice A. O'Sullivan" <mauros@iol.ie>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 18:14:19 +0000
Subject: Re: Greek fonts
Go to: http://rampages.onramp.net/~jbaima/
This is the Silver Mountain Software Home Page and John Baima has included:
" The Sgreek Fixed font can be used to display Greek with the online
documents from the Perseus project."
The zipped file is about 25Kb.
Enjoy!
Maurice
Maurice A. O'Sullivan [ Bray, Ireland ]
mauros@iol.ie
[using Eudora Pro v 2.2 ]
------------------------------
From: Mark O'Brien <Mark_O'Brien@dts.edu>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 96 11:58:38 CST
Subject: Re: Future subjunctive
> I don't see anything in 1 Cor 13:12 that's a candidate other than
> EPIGNWSOMAI, and that's a garden-variety future indicative 1 sg.
I'll take up your other comments as soon as I have time to digest them, but let
me begin by saying "ooops!" I meant to say 1Co 13:3, where we find the variant
in NA27 reading KAUQHSWMAI, which is identified in Metzger's Textual Commentary
as being a future subjunctive, which occurs (according to Metzger) infrequently
in *Byzantine* Greek, but rarely outside of that (I'd like to know where!).
Xaris,
Mark O'Brien
Grad. student, DTS
------------------------------
From: Will Wagers <wagers@computek.net>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 13:47:34 -0600
Subject: Re: Greek fonts
Thanks to all who've contributed info, e.g. Stephen and Maurice.
I downloaded SFgreek, unzipped, and ttconverted it to use on my Mac.
The Perseus text contained undefined characters (rectangle).
It may have to do with Perseus reading me as a Mac and me using
a Windows font. Or, my conversion program might be messing it up.
I already have a zillion Greek fonts on my system, each for a special
purpose: OLBgreek for the Online Bible, others for various Greek tutor
packages, The Linguist Software fonts I use in my documents. What a
bloody mess!
I can't believe there isn't a standard for language fonts. I wonder if
there is some sort of remapping software to change the correspondence
of the ASCII codes so that you can use any font with any software.
I will probably end up springing for the SMK commercial font.
Thanks again,
Will
------------------------------
From: Edward Hobbs <EHOBBS@wellesley.edu>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 16:06:35 -0500 (EST)
Subject: "=future subjunctive!"
Metzger does not say that there is a future subjunctive. The meaning of
his comment on page 564 of his "Textual Commentary" is that IF such a
reading as KAUQHSWMAI were genuine, it would imply the existence of a
future subjunctive, which would be (!). Nor does he mean by "The reading
KAUQHSWMAI (=future subjunctive!), while appearing occasionally in Byzantine
times..." that in Byzantine times they used a future subjunctive.
Rather, he means that THIS READING appears occasionally in Byzantine times
- --and goes on to call it "a grammatical monstrosity." Similarly, Debrunner
says that the interchange of W and O in this (and two other) instance(s)
is worth mentioning "because they have furnished the occasion for the
IMPOSSIBLE ACCEPTANCE OF A FUTURE SUBJUNCTIVE." (p. 15)
Metzger isn't teaching that a "future subjunctive" exists; he is saying
that it is both ridiculous (!) and a "granmmatical monstrosity."
As usual, Carl Conrad is absolutely right; "Listen to him!"
Edward Hobbs
------------------------------
From: Carlton Winbery <winberyc@popalex1.linknet.net>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 17:25:48 -0600
Subject: Re: Greek fonts
Will Wagers wrote;
>Apparently, it is not as clear cut as you imagine. Apparently, type faces
>are not protected by copyright law. But, there are tricks authors can use
>to bring them under the law. (Have you noticed than many manufacturers
>distribute the fonts free, but charge for the software to use them?) Or, so
>I read anyway. I wish I had kept the FAQ I read, so I could pass it on, but
>it fell to the disk space axe. Anyone who creates fonts for a living would,
>naturally, like us to think it is a cut and dried matter (and we may hear
>from them to that effect).
I recall that Zondervan had to pay an undisclosed amount to Linquistics
Software because of unauthorized distribution of the font Alexandria. Had
Philip had enough to continue in court the settlement could have been much
more. The key is "unauthorized use." Sure you can buy books and
distribute them, but you should read the notice on copyrighted software
(fonts are included as software) which limits copying privileges to
personal use not distribution. In using fonts in publishing, my publishers
made me get permission for the publication of camera ready material citing
the opinion of there legal counsel based on case law that it was a
violation even to publish a book written with copyrighted fonts without
getting permission and complying with the terms of that permission. If you
are doing this as a member of a college staff, the college also should be
interesting in making sure you toe the line, for your institution can be
held liable for unauthorized use. My college makes sure that programs and
fonts used here are backed by the original copies of the software and that
any program used by more than one person is backed by a site license.
Carlton Winbery
Chair Religion/Philosophy
LA College,
Pineville,La
winberyc@popalex1.linknet.net
winbery@andria.lacollege.edu
fax (318) 442-4996 or (318) 487-7425
------------------------------
From: Carlton Winbery <winberyc@popalex1.linknet.net>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 18:17:48 -0600
Subject: Re: Future subjunctive
Mark O'Brien wrote;
>I was recently reading some comments regarding the existence of the future
>subjunctive in one of the readings for 1Co 13:12, and I was thinking of doing a
>little digging in this area. Can anybody supply me some brief background info
>on the history of the future subjunctive in Greek? Thanks for your input. (I
>apologize if this has been dealt with in previous discussion.)
>
Mark later corrected the reference to I Cor. 13:3. Carl Conrad and Ed
Hobbs have both given good correctives to the idea of the existence of a
future subjunctive. I would like to comment on the textual problem at I
Cor 12:3. I am persuaded that the original is KAUXHSWMAI supported by P46,
aleph, A B and others. Some scribe (perhaps in a scriptorum) heard that
word and wrote KAUQHSWMAI (Psi, and a many others). Another scribe saw
that reading and changed it to KAUQHSOMAI (C D F G L the whole latin
tradition and some others). The aorist deponent subjunctive with hINA
makes good sense here, "in order that I might boast."
Carlton Winbery
Chair Religion/Philosophy
LA College,
Pineville,La
winberyc@popalex1.linknet.net
winbery@andria.lacollege.edu
fax (318) 442-4996 or (318) 487-7425
------------------------------
From: Paul Watkins <102737.1761@compuserve.com>
Date: 29 Jan 96 18:39:00 EST
Subject: Interested in the new Greek text?
- -------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: Interested in the new Greek text?
Date: 29-Jan-96 at 18:00
From: Paul Watkins, 102737,1761
TO: Bible list,INTERNET:bible@virginia.edu
Those interested in the new 1991 Majority text (NOT the TR)
The New Testament in the Original Greek According to the Majority/
Byzantine Textform by Robinson/Pierpont, 1991. Can be ordered through
CBD or CLW for $20. It is prefaced by a very well done explanation of
Byzantine superiority and a refutation of the Hortian system of textual
criticism. The text itself is in near manuscript format, fully delimited of
punctuation, accents, breathing marks, capitalization and
paragraphing. It is thus laid out in uncial form but with miniscule
lettering (all lowercase except for book titles) and spacing between
words. Chapter/verse numbers are added for reference. There is no
textual apparatus cluttering up the page at the bottom or in the
margin, and the type is very neat and readable. Recommended only for
people who know Greek (those who don't should use an Strong's coded
interlinear).
CLW: (800)-447-9142, $16.49 (Get an LITV and New Interlinear Bible while
Item: WDROBINS&01 you're at it- this is the only place!)
CBD: (508)-977-5000, $18.95 (May not still be carried)
Item: 54434
Paul Watkins
Grace College and Seminary
------------------------------
From: brent justin anduaga-arias <barias@unm.edu>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 17:16:34 -0700 (MST)
Subject: help on graphe artios (fwd)
I have a huge list of questions pertaining to 2nd Timothy 3:15-17.
First, v17 uses 'artios' and 'exartizo.' I have heard raging debates
about whether the words mean: 'equipped' and 'furnished' respectively, or
are they stronger: 'complete' and 'fully furnished' respectively.
Regardless of which is correct, I also would like to know (since I am
just beginning to learn Greek) if the three verses are truly conveying
the thought that ALL doctrine necessary for faith and practice are found
in scripture, or is this idea something that has been read into the text
from Reformation polemics.
Now for some more specific questions: Does the 'teaching, refutation,
and correction' address 'righteousness' as part of the 'training in
righteousness' phrase or are they distinct? In other words, could the
thought be legally reworded like this: 'teaching in righteousness,
refutation for righteousness, correction for righteousnes, and training in
righteousness' - without doing damage to Paul's intention?
What about verse 16's 'didaskalion?' It seems to me this word does in
fact just mean 'teaching.' However I have noticed that it is common for
some English translations to render it as 'doctrine' here as elsewhere.
Any comments?
- -Brent Arias
University of New Mexico
------------------------------
From: Frank Welder <fwelder@ccinet.ab.ca>
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 20:26:48 -0700
Subject: Help with a word.
I need some help with this Greek word. "kurie"
Could you email me private so that I don't tie
up the list. Thanks Frank.
------------------------------
From: Timster132@aol.com
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 23:12:11 -0500
Subject: Matt 1:19
Fellow Hellaphiles:
I was wondering if anyone could shed some light on the meaning of a phrase
in Matt 1:29. I was preaching this text back in advent, and was trying to
understand exactly what it was that Joseph was intending to do.
The text says that Joseph was MH QELWN AUTHN PARADEIGMATISAI, EBOULHQH
LAQRA APOLUSAI AUTH.
The word PARADEIGMATISAI (aorist infinitve) seems clear enough. He
doesn't want to make a (negative) public example of her (ie, public scorn or
humiliation).
But what does LAQRA APOLOUSAI AUTH mean? Is it a legal term which simply
signifies that he will "unbind" or dissolve the marriage contract privately?
Does it carry the connotations of "putting her away quietly"? Does it mean
he is putting her out on the street?
I think Joseph being a DIKAIOS doesn't necessarily mean he is being
merciful in what he is doing. It could mean (esp. here in Matt) that he was
determined to follow the law.
Any cultural insights you have, as well as legal and linguistic ones,
would be helpful.
Thanks!
Tim Staker, pastor
Poseyville Christian Church
Poseyville, IN USA
Timster132@aol.com
http://home.aol.com/Timster132
------------------------------
End of b-greek-digest V1 #94
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